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| why not a moroccan can be a christain ? | |
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| Topic Started: Mar 22 2007, 08:02 AM (152 Views) | |
| Fouad | Mar 22 2007, 08:02 AM Post #1 |
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I talked with some moroccans, when i told me i am muslim they dont believe thinking a muslim can not convert to christianity, they dont know Jesus came to all the world to save all the world, when i was muslim i was thinking the same noone can get out islam and why this ? first cause islam not allowed anyone to leave or muslims will kill you this a truth that muslim hide from western ppl, and even muslims dont think about it, they dont know they are free and when it come time for them to made choice they will find they not free. second cause every muslim they think they have a perfect elegion and they dont think even on what they believe, muslims think that the bible is corrupt, Jesus is a simple prophet, this what islam teach them, but they dont think that their prophet corrupt himselves many times and changes many htings depending on circumstance . Third muslims never have a ttitude to listen to others or try to understand others or give chance to others to express themselves and try to understand them, muslims dont know islam denied all the past that was before islam they dont know about christianity and jewish before islam what was God plan before islam . iI want tell to muslims what you hear about christianity isnt the truth, try to learn about jesus, try to understand the bible, dont let yourself be prisoner of your believe you need to decide to have freedom of thinking and searching, christriantiyis so peacefull and teach love and peeace not as they told you . |
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(And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature). (Mark 16:15 ) Download Movemegod Toolbar the first christian toolbar http://movemegod.ourtoolbar.com/ Christian Moroccan website | |
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| Marrakoshi99 | Jan 22 2008, 10:07 PM Post #2 |
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Fouad said: when i was muslim i was thinking the same noone can get out islam./. Muslims do believe that a Muslim may leave Islam for a wrong religion. We can find this ide in many of prophet Mohammad's sayings. fouad said: first cause islam not allowed anyone to leave or muslims will kill you this a truth./. Yes, that's right : in Islamic laws if a Muslim leaves his religion he must come back to Islam or be killed. this is allah's Law. This WAS the law which was revealed to all prophets. If you open your Book, you'll find it!! Foud said: every muslim they think they have a perfect elegion and they dont think even on what they believe ./. And the so-called Christians believe that their religion is perfect. And muslims ,as well, believe Islam is a perfect religion. This is based on tangible proofs and reason. Islam encourages us to use our minds when seeking the truth. we are not afraid of scrutiny,reason and questioning!! Fouad said: muslims think that the bible is corrupt,./. Many so-called christians believe that the real Bible has been changed.It is not only muslims who say so. He said: they dont think that their prophet corrupt himselves many times and changes many htings depending on circumstance ./. fouad claims he was a Muslim and knew a lot about islam. But in reality , his posts show he knows little or nothing but misty pictures of Islam !!! fouad, be independent !! Fouad said: muslims never have a ttitude to listen to others or try to understand others./. Many muslims listen and understand what non-muslims say. it is the so-called Christians and Jews who misunderstand us. Prophet Mohammad used to listen to what non-muslims were saying. And he understood their faiths. Fouad said: they dont know about christianity and jewish before islam what was God plan before islam ./. Islam is not only the religion of prophet Mohammad , but it the religion of ALL the other prophets: adam, abraham, moses, david,....christ fouad said: dont let yourself be prisoner of your believe you need to decide to have freedom of thinking and searching./. Thanks allah! I am free because the more I contemplate the other religions the more convinced of islam I become !!! |
| I walk on the steps of my dear master Jesus Christ of Nazareth.So,I am a Muslim!! | |
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| Fouad | Jun 17 2008, 08:18 PM Post #3 |
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Thank you for admiting that so where is the freedom ? and why allah said there is no compilation in relegion ? isnt that a clear contradiction ? Marrekchi do you think about your freedom if you decide to leave islam ?
we christian we belive that christianity is perfect cause God is perfect and He want us to be sure about it and God doesnt stop us in Bible to search for the truth Jesus Has been asked a lo of quesions mohamed didnt like to be asked and even the verse in auran forbedin muslims to ask surah [5:101]
And they are may verses in qurqn show mohamed didnt like questions .
There is no christian believe that the bible been changed or it is not a christian cause the bible said in Luke 21:33 (Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away) the Word of God can not be changed and who said it can be he is making God a weak one to protect His words .
I am not claimimg it is the truth i show you that and i give you proofs, by sayin that you not proof nothing in another way muslims believe everyone born muslims , so if everyone born muslim automatically i was a muslim and everyone is an ex muslim if they are not muslim now , think about it how can someome born as a muslim but he goes to a church in early age ? and another thing i live in morocco that automaticly make me be a muslim cause moroccans themselves said it is impossible for a morrocan to be non muslim , so think about this . This is the probleme with muslims when they can not keep the conversation going they start attck and make accustation that they can not prouve , i am telling you i know islam better than thousands of muslims .
Sorry to tell you that you are not free cause if you are free you should be free to leave it , but you said by yourself if you leqve it you should be killed so where is the freedom ? you do not contemplqte others with logic you just let yoursef guided by emotions and jealousy that mohemed put on you to blind you when he said kill who has no jealousy . |
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(And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature). (Mark 16:15 ) Download Movemegod Toolbar the first christian toolbar http://movemegod.ourtoolbar.com/ Christian Moroccan website | |
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| Marrakoshi99 | Sep 14 2008, 06:25 PM Post #4 |
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Fouad said: % % ....why allah said there is no compilation in relegion ? isnt that a clear contradiction ?% Islam forbid a muslem to hi religion ; and if this muslem dares to leave it he has to return to islam or be killed : that IS our law and this WAS the law of the other prophets . Just open your Holy Book to check the information as for the verse in the Koran which says (لا اكراه في الدين) =( no one is compeled /forced to accept faith), it means we can not change the HEART of a person to accept our religion. This means muslems must preach islam to non-muslems. and these non-muslems (especially jews/christians) has to turn to Islam OR give Al Jizyah ( a sum of money given every year as a token/sign that they will not come against Islam). And if a non-muslem accepts islam we don't have the right to question the sincerity of his new faith. we judge by the surface; we don't judge his heart. only Allah/God knows if the person in question is sincere or not. Fouad said: % ... Jesus Has been asked a lo of quesions mohamed didnt like to be asked and even the verse in auran forbedin muslims to ask surah [5:101] % Not all questions are allowed to be asked. there are some questions which are beyond the limits of a human's mind. Even Christ himself didn't answer all questions !!! Fouad said: %...There is no christian believe that the bible been changed ......the Word of God can not be changed and who said it can be he is making God a weak one to protect His words .% there are many christians who say/said that the 'bible' has been changed !! Fouad said: %..... Sorry to tell you that you are not free cause if you are free you should be free to leave it , % I am free inn my religion. but i am happy to be a muslem because i am always discovering things that prove that islam is the only true religion .it WAS the religion of ALL prophets from adam to abraham and from david to jesus (peace be upon them) |
| I walk on the steps of my dear master Jesus Christ of Nazareth.So,I am a Muslim!! | |
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| Marrakoshi99 | Sep 14 2008, 06:25 PM Post #5 |
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omitted because it is repeated twice .Marrakoshi99
Edited by Marrakoshi99, Sep 14 2008, 06:26 PM.
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| I walk on the steps of my dear master Jesus Christ of Nazareth.So,I am a Muslim!! | |
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| RedVelvet | Sep 15 2008, 12:37 AM Post #6 |
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Yes, sir, I do stress that "...JESUS CHRIST,... came into the world to save sinners." You said you "agree, but not in the way the so-called christians believe." Please explain how we "so-called" christians DO believe and how you believe concerning this matter. You said, "Sin is very easy to clean: just do the right thing_repent to your One Creator, mend your work and be straight in your life." Sir, sin goes much deeper than you'll ever be able to clean, wash away, amend for, or straighten out in your life on your own. It is a matter of the heart and you cannot take your heart out, wash it, and replace it and if it were even possible, how many times a day/hour would you have to/or could you do this without causing major damage to the delicate organ? How do you deal with your sin? Does it not become burdensome after a while? How much good can you do, do you do, and will you do to please Allah and your religion? Does Allah and your religion demand just a "little more" each time you think you are getting "better" or are becoming a better muslim? As a Christian, I am thankful that I can rest upon the fact that I do not have to do anything but rely upon what Jesus did for me. He took upon Himself the weight of my sin and the sin (unbelief) of the whole world... He took it "out of the way, nailing it to his cross; and having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it." (Colossians 2:14c-15) We have a saying/peom here about sin: "Sin takes you places you don't want to go, teaches you more than you want to know, keeps you longer than you want to stay, and costs you more than you want to pay." REGARDING THE PROPHETS AND REPENTANCE ALL the prophets knew nothing about salvation by grace through faith in the shed blood of Jesus Christ as Christians believe today. Jesus did not walk among the prophets,physically, but He was known of them and, at times, appeared to them in premanifestations (theophanies). They preached the law... "For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ." (John 1:17) [The written law - The Ten Commandments] They did try to live right to the best of their ability, depending upon God and obeying His commands; however, they were humans, on the same level as you and I. They were used by God for His purpose/time and as "lights' in the darkness. To my knowledge, they never preached repentance. In Hosea 13:14, the prophet Hosea recorded a message from God,"I will ransom them from the power of the grave; I will redeem (purchase, buy back) them from death: O death, I will be thy plagues; O grave, I will be thy destruction: repentance shall be hid from mine eyes." My personal opinion is that when the prophets did wrong/sin... they acknowledged it, asked forgiveness, and turned from it as we do/should do today. This is true repentance. The prophet Jeremiah recorded in chapter 4:27-28, "For thus hath the LORD said, The whole land shall be desolate; yet will I not make a full end, For this shall the earth mourn, and the heavens above be black: because I have spoken it, I have purposed it, and will not repent, neither will I turn back from it." In Chapter 18:5-10, "Then the word of the LORD came to me saying, O house of Israel, cannot I do with you as a potter? saith the LORD, Behold, as the clay is in the potter's hand, so are ye in mine hand, O house of Israel. At what instant I shall speak concerning a nation, and concerning a kingdom, to pluck up, and to pull down, and to destroy it; If that nation, against whom I have pronounced, turn from their evil, I will repent of the evil that I thought to do unto them. And at what instant I shall speak concerning a nation, and concerning a kingdom, to build and to plant it. If it do evil in my sight, that it obey not my voice, then will I repent of the good, wherewith I said I would benefit them." In chapter 26:3, "If so be they will hearken, and turn every man form his evil way, that I may repent me of the evil which I purpose to do unto them because of the evil of their doings." Chapter 42:9-10, "... Thus saith the LORD, the God of Israel, unto whom ye sent me to present your supplication before him; If ye will still abide in this land, then will I build you, and not pull you down, and I will plant you,and not pluck you up: for I repent me of the evil that I have done unto you." The prophet Ezekiel recorded in chapter 18:30, "Therefore I will judge you, O house of Israel, every one according to his ways, saith the Lord GOD. Repent, and turn yourselves from all your trangression; so iniquity shall not be your ruin." Chapter 24:14, "I the LORD have spoken it: it shall come to pass, and I will do it; I will not go back, neither will I spare, neither will I repent; according to thy ways , and according to thy dings, shall they judge thee, saith the Lord GOD." The prophet Joel recorded in chapter 2:14, "Who knoweth if he will return and repent, and leave a blessing behind him: even a meat offering and a drink offering unto the LORD your God?" The prophet Jonah recorded in chapter 3:9-10, "Who can tell if God will turn and repent, and turn away from his fierce anger, that we perish not? And God saw their works, that they turned from their evil way; and God repented of the evil, that he had said that he would do unto them; and he did it not." As you can read, the prophets wrote about God not unleashing His anger and wrath upon the nation, Israel, because of their disobedience and wicked/evil doings... not a specific message for the people to repent. However, the message to repent is directed to the people when delivered by the apostles and Jesus, Himself, in the New Testament. Matthew records in chapter 3:2, the message of the Apostle John (a/k/a John the Baptist) as he preached in the wilderness near Judaea, "And saying, Repent ye: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand." and in chapter 4:17, Jesus speaks the same message in a different area, "From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand." Mark records in chapter 1:14-15, "Now after that John was put in prison, Jesus came unto Galilee, preaching the gospel of the kingdom of God, And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel." Luke, in chapter 13:3&5, repeats the message - twice - "I tell you , Nay, but except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish." In the Acts of the apostles, chapter 3:19-21, "Repent ye therefore , and be ye converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord; And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you: Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began." The Apostle Peter preached in Acts 8:20-22, "But Peter said unto him, Thy money perish with thee, because thou hast thought that the gift of God may be purchased with money. Thou hast neither part nor lot in this matter: for thy heart is not right in the sight of God. Repent therefore of this thy wickedness, and pray God, if perhaps the thought of thine heart may be forgiven thee." Chapter 17:30, "And the times of the ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent." In Chapter 26: 19-20, the Apostle Paul was giving the testimony of his conversion before King Agrippa, he said, "Whereupon, O King Agrippa, I was disobedient unto the heavenly vision: But shewed first unto them of Damascus, and at Jerusalem, and throughout all the coasts of Judaea, and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, and do works meet for repentance." CONCERNING SIN AND ITS PAYMENT You addressed my quotation, "For the wages(payment) of sin is death;" as not referring to crucifixion. I agree... it does not, directly refer to crucifixion, but it shows that there must be a wage (payment) either made or paid, for sin. The cost was too high for mankind to appease the Holy God, so HE sent HIS "only begotten Son" to stand in mankind's place... to die for the sin (unbelief) of the world, and in exchange, offers the gift of everlasting life to whosoever will believe this is true. DEATH is NOT hell, but where man's spirit departs from the house (body), in which it has resided for however long the man has lived. A metaphor... some may think that because there IS a transference of the body into the ground where it will return to the dust from which it came, but the soul/spirit is released to its eternal destiny... heaven (for believers) and hell (for unbelievers). Heaven is a place of eternal bliss, but hell is a place of eternal fire/flames/torments. IF one goes to hell, he goes as an intruder because hell was not prepared for him... "...Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels." (Matthew 25:41b) Could you imagine being in a place where you are unwanted/unwelcomed, being irritated, cursed, tormented by fierce creatures/beasts/demons, feeling excruciating pain of fire/smoke/flames FOREVER and never being able to alleviate the situation? People say this is NOT reality, but I'd rather put my trust in ONE who promised eternal life with HIM in heaven, than to go through life trusting in my self goodness/works or in a religion. The Person of Christ is much easier to believe. LIFE is NOT payment for good works... how much good works is needed to appease Allah or to earn your way to paradise (heaven, as we call our place of eternity), have you attained enough or will you have attained enough upon your death... how much longer do you have to live? LIFE is uncertain, there is only one breath between mankind (you, included) and eternity. If your next breath is your last, where will your eternal destination be? Are you eternally assured of Allah's blessing and what is his blessing... to continue fullfilling the desires of your flesh in eternity? LIFE is NOT good (right, proper, excellent, virtuous, kind, safe, adequate, sound, valid, profitable, polite)... and there is no goodness in mankind. While Jesus was here upon earth as a man, someone came to Him saying, "And, behold one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life? And he (Jesus) said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments." I promise to continue addressing the issues and comments made, but not at this moment. May I ask that you think on the above things!!! Edited by RedVelvet, Sep 17 2008, 12:58 AM.
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 I Samuel 12:24 ~ Only fear the LORD, and serve him in truth with all your heart: for consider how great things he hath done for you. | |
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