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| Topic Started: Mar 14 2009, 06:41:24 AM (228 Views) | |
| Phoenix_Kensai | Mar 14 2009, 06:41:24 AM Post #1 |
Because now is only now.
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'Cause we kind of need one. Things that need to get done at the moment... -The emotion system: How will it work, and how will we take personalities and such into account? I suppose the latter at least will be mostly my job, given that I'm the programmer, but... any ideas would be nice, since I'm a bit lost. >_> We also need to finalize which emotions to use. -The skill system: How do characters gain AP; through leveling up, winning battles, or some other method? Any would be a cinch to implement, so this is mostly about preference... for some reason I'd like to do something different and more unusual, but no matter what we choose we should give some thought to the impact it would have on gameplay. -The class system: do we have one, beyond the current skill system? And if so, how should it work? -SP: Do we use it? Traditional RPG systems can and do work perfectly fine, though innovation certainly isn't a bad thing... but on the other hand, SP shakes the normal system up so much that I'm honestly kind of torn on whether or not to use it. -The characters: We'll need to finalize these before planning the story, since I think Book was right in saying that the characters should write the story and not the other way around, or whatever it is. Once we get a basic plan out I can get to work on the beginning of the actual game, regardless of how much of the system design has been finished. |
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| Pump Noodle | Mar 14 2009, 02:49:20 PM Post #2 |
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le Perdu
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Hmmm... I had an intelligent thought going through my head, but it realized who I was and fled. |
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Life is going faster than I'll ever be able to keep up with... and that's good. Life wouldn't be fun otherwise, eh? "IT IS A GOD THING" | |
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| Phoenix_Kensai | Mar 15 2009, 06:54:02 AM Post #3 |
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Because now is only now.
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Random plot idea: Maybe have the plot involve two (not necessarily evil) Bloodmason Chessmasters working towards separate goals, creating a rift in the group with the main characters caught in the middle. |
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| Pump Noodle | Mar 15 2009, 04:14:02 PM Post #4 |
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le Perdu
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That'd be pretty cool. These would be outside of the party, right? |
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Life is going faster than I'll ever be able to keep up with... and that's good. Life wouldn't be fun otherwise, eh? "IT IS A GOD THING" | |
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| Phoenix_Kensai | Mar 15 2009, 06:42:57 PM Post #5 |
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Because now is only now.
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That's what I imagined, but there's no reason we could have one or both in the party, if we could get it to work. ...Except that I'm not sure how well that would turn out, unless maybe we had one join the party in secret and be revealed later, like what happens in a certain DS RPG. Or we could have both and have the party split up later on or something, but I'm not sure if that would be a good idea with the skill system and everything. |
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| Pump Noodle | Mar 15 2009, 09:29:23 PM Post #6 |
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le Perdu
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Or we could make it so that they're outside of the party at some point in time, and then make the player choose who you help. You finish helping them, and they join. Then they're mutually exclusive. They could have minor effects on story later. |
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Life is going faster than I'll ever be able to keep up with... and that's good. Life wouldn't be fun otherwise, eh? "IT IS A GOD THING" | |
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| Phoenix_Kensai | Mar 16 2009, 05:07:45 AM Post #7 |
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Because now is only now.
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Maybe... We should probably plan the plot in general and then what they're doing before going too far with this, though. But, more ideas are always welcome. |
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| Pump Noodle | Mar 18 2009, 10:19:55 PM Post #8 |
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le Perdu
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Mk, so... you've sorta confused me. You said maybe we should make the characters and make the story around them, but then said make a plot and see what to do with the characters... which one first then? I'm actually pro characters first right now. So I'll make an executive decision, without being an exec, and say characters. Are we scrapping the previous characters? I think we should. |
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Life is going faster than I'll ever be able to keep up with... and that's good. Life wouldn't be fun otherwise, eh? "IT IS A GOD THING" | |
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| Phoenix_Kensai | Mar 18 2009, 11:16:22 PM Post #9 |
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Because now is only now.
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...Well, I didn't mean to say that we should plan the plot before the characters, just that we should plan it before going too far with that idea I had. I do agree that we should plan characters first and plot second, though. The setting is also important, and should be worked on along with both of those... at the moment I've been coming up with ideas based on what we were planning to use before, but there's no reason we'd have to stick to that. About the old characters... well, I don't think we should restrain ourselves to sticking with just them, but I don't think we should throw them out entirely either. I kind of like the basic ideas for the main human, fae, and monster we came up with, and I've thought of some more details for them, but we don't have to use them. |
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| Pump Noodle | Mar 19 2009, 01:10:07 AM Post #10 |
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le Perdu
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Alright then. So, maybe we should move to the character topics. Or, better yet, make a new one for all of them in general, and post what you want to keep. edit: I do like most of what was decided on for the main character. Edited by Pump Noodle, Mar 19 2009, 01:10:51 AM.
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Life is going faster than I'll ever be able to keep up with... and that's good. Life wouldn't be fun otherwise, eh? "IT IS A GOD THING" | |
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| Phoenix_Kensai | Mar 19 2009, 01:21:06 AM Post #11 |
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Because now is only now.
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I suppose. I'll make the topic when I get the chance. Or someone else can do it. It doesn't really matter. Also, I'd like to decide on the last emotion to use if we can, since we need to do that before I can really start working out how to plan the whole thing. I... honestly can't think of anything, though. |
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| Pump Noodle | Mar 19 2009, 03:39:51 AM Post #12 |
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le Perdu
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What are the other emotions? |
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Life is going faster than I'll ever be able to keep up with... and that's good. Life wouldn't be fun otherwise, eh? "IT IS A GOD THING" | |
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| Phoenix_Kensai | Mar 19 2009, 03:50:13 AM Post #13 |
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Because now is only now.
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Red: Ardor Orange: Anger Yellow: Fear Green: Happiness Blue: Compassion Violet: Pride This is what we had. I was intending to replace happiness, since... well, it just sounds odd to use as an emotion in battle, at least to me. We don't have to dump it, though. |
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| Phoenix_Kensai | Mar 27 2009, 07:51:23 AM Post #14 |
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Because now is only now.
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Jack says: Also, you should totally have Jeigan do the tutorial. Yes. Edited by Phoenix_Kensai, Mar 27 2009, 07:51:33 AM.
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| Phoenix_Kensai | Apr 15 2009, 07:07:55 AM Post #15 |
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Because now is only now.
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I suppose I ought to get back to work on this. As for the emotion system... well, does everyone think it would work okay to just track affinity for each emotion, maybe with a couple of other traits such as stability? Though that's the simplest way to do things, I didn't like the idea at first since it doesn't represent personality directly, but... well, if you think about it, it does a decent job, as a character with a high pride affinity would naturally be confident, while a character with low anger and pride and high compassion would likely be reserved and kindhearted. |
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| Pump Noodle | Apr 15 2009, 08:35:06 PM Post #16 |
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le Perdu
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Do what you think will work best, I don't know enough to understand. |
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Life is going faster than I'll ever be able to keep up with... and that's good. Life wouldn't be fun otherwise, eh? "IT IS A GOD THING" | |
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| Phoenix_Kensai | Apr 21 2009, 05:04:37 AM Post #17 |
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Because now is only now.
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I... really need to get back into this. To be honest, what would help me most is to get more people involved and active in this project. Even if nobody has much to contribute, having a decent number of people discussing this gave me a lot of inspiration to work back when I first started, which is what I need the most. |
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| Pump Noodle | Apr 22 2009, 12:37:54 AM Post #18 |
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le Perdu
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Hmmm... well, I wish I could help there, but I have about zero influence over other members. |
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Life is going faster than I'll ever be able to keep up with... and that's good. Life wouldn't be fun otherwise, eh? "IT IS A GOD THING" | |
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| Jackytf the member the admin | May 4 2009, 11:58:33 PM Post #19 |
Jack Lord the muy macho not Canadian admin
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Needs more lazers. Maybe organic magical lazers? A lazer-fruit? Squeeze it and it shoots lazers? All fun and games until the main character canonically kills himself off with one? Then you have to play as the witty sidekick? Yeah, the main character was actually a Jeigan. And now the sidekick's all serious'd and/or emo. And the badguy gets all epic. Point being, that's why I don't help with this thing. You don't want my help. And stewy, what the hell does that even mean? |
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R.I.P.: Lauder, the lv. 1 Shadowmaster Henreid, some lv. 9 Wanderer Bobby, a lv. 1 Officer and 
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| Pump Noodle | May 5 2009, 12:01:04 AM Post #20 |
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le Perdu
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Not really sure anymore, but I think it was that there's no one on the forum I could get to help because no one would ever listen to me. |
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Life is going faster than I'll ever be able to keep up with... and that's good. Life wouldn't be fun otherwise, eh? "IT IS A GOD THING" | |
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| Jackytf the member the admin | May 5 2009, 12:17:59 AM Post #21 |
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Jack Lord the muy macho not Canadian admin
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Ah. |
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R.I.P.: Lauder, the lv. 1 Shadowmaster Henreid, some lv. 9 Wanderer Bobby, a lv. 1 Officer and
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| Phoenix_Kensai | Jun 2 2009, 07:18:18 PM Post #22 |
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Because now is only now.
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...Actually, I kind of like the idea of killing off the main character early on, though we haven't planned for that yet. And I definitely like the idea of lazer fruit. I'll make sure to include them, at least as a hidden item, if only to spite you in proving that we do want your help. |
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| Pump Noodle | Jun 2 2009, 09:05:02 PM Post #23 |
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le Perdu
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Aha I have no real clue what was happening in this anymore. |
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Life is going faster than I'll ever be able to keep up with... and that's good. Life wouldn't be fun otherwise, eh? "IT IS A GOD THING" | |
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| Phoenix_Kensai | Aug 14 2009, 07:28:47 PM Post #24 |
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Because now is only now.
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Okay, so. There are two problems I need to work out at the moment... -What aspects of the characters' personalities do we represent and change with variables? While I was opposed to it before, the best solution I can come up with now is to mainly just give each character an affinity for each emotion, maybe with a couple of other values such as stability. The other option is to... well, just drop the system and handle it internally for each character, and not worry about in-game player choices too much. That would save a heck of a lot of trouble in development time, particularly since it wouldn't require writing multiple scripts to take different personalities into account; it might also be easier on the player, since they wouldn't have to worry about, say, in-game events and a couple of bad choices turning their raging barbarian into a pacifist. To make up for this we could track other things, such as character relationships, which probably wouldn't be as hard. -What to do about SP? I don't see the current system working too well in the long run, since it's hard to simultaneously balance the enemies to die quickly, be a significant enough challenge to weaken the party, and never do too much damage through luck, all of which are necessary to keep battles interesting in this system. Rather than keeping post-battle regeneration as a set, high value for HP and MP, my idea have it change throughout the game. At first it could be limited to MP (and maybe HP for the fighters), but in relatively small amounts, and equipping certain items and learning skills would increase it as the game goes on; maybe barbarians would learn regeneration, which heals a little HP each turn and a significant portion after battle, while mages would get abilities that boost their MP regeneration. I also thought that these abilities could change temporarily in the middle of dungeons, though I'm not sure how... maybe with stats called vigor and focus representing HP and MP regeneration, which go down as the characters fight more battles or push themselves too far, but can be raised by spending SP? They could also have other effects, such as low focus making the characters spells and emotions more unpredictable but potentially more powerful. Edited by Phoenix_Kensai, Aug 14 2009, 07:29:02 PM.
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| Pump Noodle | Aug 15 2009, 07:49:35 PM Post #25 |
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le Perdu
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Hmmm, well I don't really understand the second part. But I get what you're saying for the first part. Do what you would prefer, or whichever is easiest. Ya. Also, ever play enchanted arms? Is the vitality point system like the SP system? |
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Life is going faster than I'll ever be able to keep up with... and that's good. Life wouldn't be fun otherwise, eh? "IT IS A GOD THING" | |
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| Phoenix_Kensai | Aug 16 2009, 04:19:41 AM Post #26 |
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Because now is only now.
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I haven't played it, but if it's like the system in Wild ARMs, I think I know what you're talking about. I'll go look it up. ... ...Er, did you mean the vitality point system in Enchanted Arms or the SP system in Enchanted Arms? |
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| Pump Noodle | Aug 17 2009, 11:45:04 PM Post #27 |
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le Perdu
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Errr I think vitality. It's been a few weeks. It goes down a little bit each battle to restore your health and mp entirely, until your VP runs out. However, if you managed to win in one turn, you were restored without losing any VP, and if someone died, they'd lose even more VP. Like that, but it made special attacks very important if you wanted to one turn them so you wouldn't lose VP. It seemed like the idea in your SP system... I think. Except it wasn't like extra lives, it just restored your life automatically, so it wasn't like "oh you actually have 2000 HP but we're only gonna say 500" it was "500 HP, but at the beginning of every battle, unless you go too long, then you'll just keep your HP from previous battle" |
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Life is going faster than I'll ever be able to keep up with... and that's good. Life wouldn't be fun otherwise, eh? "IT IS A GOD THING" | |
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| Phoenix_Kensai | Aug 19 2009, 04:07:18 AM Post #28 |
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Because now is only now.
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Oh, okay. That is kind of similar to the system in WILD ARMs, except in that it's just automatically spent after battle to restore HP, which... makes it seem kind of pointless. I think I'm going to have to give the SP system some more thought and hammer out the details, though, since I don't think it'll work well like this. I suppose I should do the same for the emotion system too, so that we can get the whole thing more or less finished... |
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| Pump Noodle | Aug 19 2009, 08:15:09 PM Post #29 |
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le Perdu
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Yeah. Just to clarify, the VP system from enchanted arms does the same thing as what you said WILD arms did, except you could prevent the loss if you finished in one turn, but that wouldn't apply here because this isn't like Team A turn, Team B turn. Also, I disagree about it automatically restoring HP being useless. A system I would like would go like this. You have so much SP or what not, and at the end of battle, you lose one point to restore HP (If necessary) and the same for MP or whatever we're using. Unless, of course, you want the option to be available to use the SP or not. Also, maybe an extra SP point would be used if the character died. But I dunno if that's what you want. I like it because it would allow for the character to actually have to fight smart to survive battles, so it'd be a challenge, you could die if you messed up, but at the same time, not have to avoid battles because you're almost dead. It lets you use your magic skills in normal battles, keeping it interesting and not just attack attack attack attack with the occasional heal or such. And then, boss battles would just be even more challenging... But it's up to you. I just really liked the system. |
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Life is going faster than I'll ever be able to keep up with... and that's good. Life wouldn't be fun otherwise, eh? "IT IS A GOD THING" | |
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| Phoenix_Kensai | Aug 20 2009, 04:14:54 AM Post #30 |
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Because now is only now.
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When I said that I was just referring to the system in Wild ARMs (at least, Alter Code: F, as that's the one I remember). I found that kind of pointless since restoring HP seemed easy anyway, though admittedly I ran from almost all the random battles to make the game more of a challenge. I think the system you posted sounds good, it just might raise the problem of the party just throwing everything they have at a specific number of battles determined by their SP, and then running from the rest, at least with the basics I had planned before for SP regeneration and such... if I dump the automatic resurrection/MP restoration thing and increase the amount of SP-restoring items you get, though, it might work better. And I think maybe it would be best to dump the automatic resurrection... while I liked the idea of the struggle to preserve SP that each battle would present because of it, it would also lead to the problem of running low on SP making boss fights impossible, which would be bad. I think I would be able to preserve that if dying in battle increased the cost, as you said, but... that leads to problems with balancing resurrection items/spells, since with those you could just bring a character back before the battle ends to avoid the cost. Maybe resurrecting a character takes SP from them too? But then we come again to the problem of boss battles becoming impossible without SP, though this time to a lesser extent... it could be that characters with SP are restored to full HP and/or MP when resurrected, while those without are rather low, which can be a pretty significant difference in boss battles. |
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| Pump Noodle | Aug 20 2009, 01:53:16 PM Post #31 |
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le Perdu
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Ahhh... I completely forgot that our system would take effect during battle as well. The one I was talking about only worked outside of battle. That way, the HP you have is all the HP you have, you die, use a res item during battle then. The SP system would more or less just start you off fresh for each battle. It wouldn't really help during battle. If the SP system took effect during battle, then you may as well just give you characters lots of HP and MP reserves... A way around it could be using skills that cost SP that resurrect or replenish MP or HP or something. That way, it still depletes it, but the player has to execute the action n such. Just ideas though, do what you think works best for what you have planned! |
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Life is going faster than I'll ever be able to keep up with... and that's good. Life wouldn't be fun otherwise, eh? "IT IS A GOD THING" | |
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| Luneth | Aug 20 2009, 03:58:21 PM Post #32 |
I'm not real. Trust me.
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Perhaps SP should be used to execute skills exclusively, but those skills are often skills that resurrect people, replenish HP/MP, etc. If such is the case, the melee based character could have one that is a chance to self-rez when they die run out of HP. Also, for late game, SP could be used to do your super-gigantic attacks, which in turn makes then riskier as you are more capable of dying then. To summarize, SP = Struggle Points. Also, along that line of thought, mayhaps you would gain SP when a character is below 25% HP? That way the game has another level of strategy. If that happens, they could also replenish more SP if another character is below 25% as well. How many active party members would we be having again? |
| "Why don't you get a clone, so you can GO flower YOURSELF?!" | |
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| Phoenix_Kensai | Aug 27 2009, 03:58:35 AM Post #33 |
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Because now is only now.
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I'll get back to responding to this soon. I've just been on an Exalted binge recently, and I got a bit carried away joining games, so I've kind of had my hands full trying to make characters for them all...
Four is the default limit in XP, and I don't know of any easy way to increase it, so unless someone finds one I guess we'll be going with that. |
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