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Where are the Supporters?; The Silence is Deafening...
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Topic Started: Sep 27 2006, 05:31 PM (10,507 Views)
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jen
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Oct 9 2006, 05:07 PM
Post #76
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5th Grade
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- Zeke
- Oct 1 2006, 06:30 PM
- garfield
- Oct 1 2006, 02:34 PM
1) I don't think not wanting to be around negative people is a bad thing. Seriously, why would I want my children in a school with parents who only focus on the negatives? It is important for both supporters and opposers of the LI to just move on and focus on making the best out the present situation whether you are happy with it or not. Our schools will work just fine if that is what we want. However, if we want our schools to fail or expect them to fail they more than likely will. Be careful of the self-fulfilling prophecy. I'm just being honest when I say that I'd rather not be around negative people and it certainly wouldn't bother me in the least if they left the district, because truthfully, I don't think that many parents are continually negative. It's just that the ones that are spend a lot of time on this site.
2) Regarding taping classroom conversations, please read the following from the Michigan Legislature:
THE MICHIGAN PENAL CODE (EXCERPT) Act 328 of 1931
750.539d Installation, placement, or use of device for observing, recording, transmitting, photographing or eavesdropping in private place.
Sec. 539d.
(1) Except as otherwise provided in this section, a person shall not do either of the following:
(a) Install, place, or use in any private place, without the consent of the person or persons entitled to privacy in that place, any device for observing, recording, transmitting, photographing, or eavesdropping upon the sounds or events in that place.
(B) Distribute, disseminate, or transmit for access by any other person a recording, photograph, or visual image the person knows or has reason to know was obtained in violation of this section.
(2) This section does not prohibit security monitoring in a residence if conducted by or at the direction of the owner or principal occupant of that residence unless conducted for a lewd or lascivious purpose.
(3) A person who violates or attempts to violate this section is guilty of a crime as follows:
(a) For a violation or attempted violation of subsection (1)(a):
(i) Except as provided in subparagraph (ii), the person is guilty of a felony punishable by imprisonment for not more than 2 years or a fine of not more than $2,000.00, or both.
(ii) If the person was previously convicted of violating or attempting to violate this section, the person is guilty of a felony punishable by imprisonment for not more than 5 years or a fine of not more than $5,000.00, or both.
(B) For a violation or attempted violation of subsection (1)(B), the person is guilty of a felony punishable by imprisonment for not more than 5 years or a fine of not more than $5,000.00, or both.
(4) This section does not prohibit a person from being charged with, convicted of, or punished for any other violation of law committed by that person while violating or attempting to violate subsection (1)(a) or (b
Furthermore, most school districts have policies against taping in the classroom without administrative or at least teacher approval. Now I realize some of you may want to argue the definition of a private place. Typically, classrooms are considered private while common areas such as the auditorium and the gym are not. A private location is one where the general public does not typically have access. Anyone can go to the school play or basketball game, but schools don't let anyone come in off the street and go into classrooms.
3) Regarding declining enrollments, the school district that I work in was down 5% at the beginning of the school year. Surrounding districts were down even more students. Over 3% of our students went out of state. The most common destinations were Indiana, Illinois, Arizona, and Texas. Ohio's economy is just as bad as ours, so few families moved there. Only 1% of our students went to other districts within the state. In recent weeks, we have had a few new students. Most of these students came from Detroit. However, we did not see too many new students as we are not a "School-Of-Choice" district. Since Livonia is not either, we should not see too many Detroit kids moving to our schools. Now clearly some families did move out due to the LI, but not all moved due to the LI. Do not blame the LI for everything that doesn't go perfect.
4) In my school district, we have had staff changes, students have had their teachers changed, and we have changed bus routes during the past three weeks. As much as we'd like to have everything perfect when the kids walk through the door, the truth is you don't always know what you are going to get until the kids show up in September. Don't judge the LI on what you see now, because many other things contribute to the things that may be frustrating you. Wait until we are a few months in to pass judgement. If there are still major problems in a few months, then you should be complaining.
A public school is not considered a private place.
Actually, to an extent it is. It is public in that anyone can attend yet not everyone is able to access the building whenever they want, etc. It is a public place with an asterisk.
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SJC
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Oct 9 2006, 07:54 PM
Post #77
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Principal
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- jen
- Oct 9 2006, 05:07 PM
Actually, to an extent it is. It is public in that anyone can attend yet not everyone is able to access the building whenever they want, etc. It is a public place with an asterisk.
I assume Zeke is talking about legal definitions of "public" and "private". I'm not familiar with the legal definitions but I think it would be challenging to try and argue that public schools are private.
When I was working in the UK I believe the called the private schools "public schools". Thank goodness we're not trying to have this discussion over there.
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Livonia Voter
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Oct 9 2006, 08:50 PM
Post #78
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Principal
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- SJC
- Oct 9 2006, 07:54 PM
- jen
- Oct 9 2006, 05:07 PM
Actually, to an extent it is. It is public in that anyone can attend yet not everyone is able to access the building whenever they want, etc. It is a public place with an asterisk.
I assume Zeke is talking about legal definitions of "public" and "private". I'm not familiar with the legal definitions but I think it would be challenging to try and argue that public schools are private. When I was working in the UK I believe the called the private schools "public schools". Thank goodness we're not trying to have this discussion over there.
And even public parks, etc have hours in which you can use them. But the restriction doesn't make it any less public.
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jen
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Oct 9 2006, 09:06 PM
Post #79
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5th Grade
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I just meant that they aren't public in the sense that anyone can trespass or do whatever they want in the school whenever they want.
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Zeke
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Oct 9 2006, 09:18 PM
Post #80
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Principal
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- jen
- Oct 9 2006, 06:07 PM
- Zeke
- Oct 1 2006, 06:30 PM
- garfield
- Oct 1 2006, 02:34 PM
1) I don't think not wanting to be around negative people is a bad thing. Seriously, why would I want my children in a school with parents who only focus on the negatives? It is important for both supporters and opposers of the LI to just move on and focus on making the best out the present situation whether you are happy with it or not. Our schools will work just fine if that is what we want. However, if we want our schools to fail or expect them to fail they more than likely will. Be careful of the self-fulfilling prophecy. I'm just being honest when I say that I'd rather not be around negative people and it certainly wouldn't bother me in the least if they left the district, because truthfully, I don't think that many parents are continually negative. It's just that the ones that are spend a lot of time on this site.
2) Regarding taping classroom conversations, please read the following from the Michigan Legislature:
THE MICHIGAN PENAL CODE (EXCERPT) Act 328 of 1931
750.539d Installation, placement, or use of device for observing, recording, transmitting, photographing or eavesdropping in private place.
Sec. 539d.
(1) Except as otherwise provided in this section, a person shall not do either of the following:
(a) Install, place, or use in any private place, without the consent of the person or persons entitled to privacy in that place, any device for observing, recording, transmitting, photographing, or eavesdropping upon the sounds or events in that place.
(B) Distribute, disseminate, or transmit for access by any other person a recording, photograph, or visual image the person knows or has reason to know was obtained in violation of this section.
(2) This section does not prohibit security monitoring in a residence if conducted by or at the direction of the owner or principal occupant of that residence unless conducted for a lewd or lascivious purpose.
(3) A person who violates or attempts to violate this section is guilty of a crime as follows:
(a) For a violation or attempted violation of subsection (1)(a):
(i) Except as provided in subparagraph (ii), the person is guilty of a felony punishable by imprisonment for not more than 2 years or a fine of not more than $2,000.00, or both.
(ii) If the person was previously convicted of violating or attempting to violate this section, the person is guilty of a felony punishable by imprisonment for not more than 5 years or a fine of not more than $5,000.00, or both.
(B) For a violation or attempted violation of subsection (1)(B), the person is guilty of a felony punishable by imprisonment for not more than 5 years or a fine of not more than $5,000.00, or both.
(4) This section does not prohibit a person from being charged with, convicted of, or punished for any other violation of law committed by that person while violating or attempting to violate subsection (1)(a) or (b
Furthermore, most school districts have policies against taping in the classroom without administrative or at least teacher approval. Now I realize some of you may want to argue the definition of a private place. Typically, classrooms are considered private while common areas such as the auditorium and the gym are not. A private location is one where the general public does not typically have access. Anyone can go to the school play or basketball game, but schools don't let anyone come in off the street and go into classrooms.
3) Regarding declining enrollments, the school district that I work in was down 5% at the beginning of the school year. Surrounding districts were down even more students. Over 3% of our students went out of state. The most common destinations were Indiana, Illinois, Arizona, and Texas. Ohio's economy is just as bad as ours, so few families moved there. Only 1% of our students went to other districts within the state. In recent weeks, we have had a few new students. Most of these students came from Detroit. However, we did not see too many new students as we are not a "School-Of-Choice" district. Since Livonia is not either, we should not see too many Detroit kids moving to our schools. Now clearly some families did move out due to the LI, but not all moved due to the LI. Do not blame the LI for everything that doesn't go perfect.
4) In my school district, we have had staff changes, students have had their teachers changed, and we have changed bus routes during the past three weeks. As much as we'd like to have everything perfect when the kids walk through the door, the truth is you don't always know what you are going to get until the kids show up in September. Don't judge the LI on what you see now, because many other things contribute to the things that may be frustrating you. Wait until we are a few months in to pass judgement. If there are still major problems in a few months, then you should be complaining.
A public school is not considered a private place.
Actually, to an extent it is. It is public in that anyone can attend yet not everyone is able to access the building whenever they want, etc. It is a public place with an asterisk.
They don't use asterisks in court. A public school is not legally a private place.
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cat
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Oct 10 2006, 09:03 AM
Post #81
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Principal
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- jen
- Oct 9 2006, 09:06 PM
I just meant that they aren't public in the sense that anyone can trespass or do whatever they want in the school whenever they want.
right..like when there are parents on the playground just before recess, they are asked to leave.
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Anna Krome
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Oct 10 2006, 01:04 PM
Post #82
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The Supporters are driving their kids to school, because they are PO'd about the erratic bus schedule.
AK
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Livonia Voter
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Oct 10 2006, 05:35 PM
Post #83
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- Anna Krome
- Oct 10 2006, 01:04 PM
The Supporters are driving their kids to school, because they are PO'd about the erratic bus schedule.
AK
Hmmmm....
Lets figure out the best way to respond to the poor supporters.
1. I told you so. 2. Don't blame me, I voted for RECALL! 3. Isn't this what you wanted? 4. Yep, they lied. 5. Ready to vote in May?
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jodygirlh
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Oct 10 2006, 08:05 PM
Post #84
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Very Funny, LV!
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SJC
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Oct 24 2006, 12:04 PM
Post #85
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The supporters are back in my neighborhood. This time with "Vote Yes on 5" signs. The same houses that had "For Kids Sake" signs. The same houses with no kids in LPS.
Did we ever figure out why the MEA supported the LI? MEA supporting LI is like the UAW telling us to by foreign cars. Why support a program that promised to be so disastrous to enrollment?
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Shelly
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Oct 24 2006, 12:51 PM
Post #86
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Here's some good news from the front...I have a child at Roosevelt - her bus is on time, she loves to ride with her friends in the morning and afternoon, her classmates are all doing very well ( due to a fantastic teacher - Kim Carty), the staff at Roosevelt is wonderful beyond description and we are thrilled!! I have another daughter at Emerson who has developed into a beautiful, independant young lady. Mr. Toby and Dr. Wallace are phenominal and it shows in the behavior of the students. If you have complaints about the schools your child is attending, find a productive means to a solution. Complaning without pursuing a solution becomes a trait we would not accept in our children. The transistion can be what you make of it - for your child's sake.
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f11
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Oct 24 2006, 01:07 PM
Post #87
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LPS, transportation for all
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- SJC
- Oct 24 2006, 12:04 PM
The supporters are back in my neighborhood. This time with "Vote Yes on 5" signs. The same houses that had "For Kids Sake" signs. The same houses with no kids in LPS.
Did we ever figure out why the MEA supported the LI? MEA supporting LI is like the UAW telling us to by foreign cars. Why support a program that promised to be so disastrous to enrollment?
Cause they essentially didn't touch the employees as opposed to Garden City where the MEA supported recall(Garden city wanted to outsource)
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NFarquharson
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Oct 24 2006, 01:15 PM
Post #88
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- Shelly
- Oct 24 2006, 12:51 PM
Here's some good news from the front...I have a child at Roosevelt - her bus is on time, she loves to ride with her friends in the morning and afternoon, her classmates are all doing very well ( due to a fantastic teacher - Kim Carty), the staff at Roosevelt is wonderful beyond description and we are thrilled!! I have another daughter at Emerson who has developed into a beautiful, independant young lady. Mr. Toby and Dr. Wallace are phenominal and it shows in the behavior of the students. If you have complaints about the schools your child is attending, find a productive means to a solution. Complaning without pursuing a solution becomes a trait we would not accept in our children. The transistion can be what you make of it - for your child's sake.
Hmmm... Anna has children being bused from the Adams neighborhood to Roosevelt also, but she has had some problems, including the unexpected use of contracted buses rather than LPS. It appears that consistancy is still an issue. Hopefully everyone can get the same good service that Shelly is getting now if we all work together.
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snickers420
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Oct 24 2006, 02:22 PM
Post #89
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- Shelly
- Oct 24 2006, 12:51 PM
Here's some good news from the front...I have a child at Roosevelt - her bus is on time, she loves to ride with her friends in the morning and afternoon, her classmates are all doing very well ( due to a fantastic teacher - Kim Carty), the staff at Roosevelt is wonderful beyond description and we are thrilled!! I have another daughter at Emerson who has developed into a beautiful, independant young lady. Mr. Toby and Dr. Wallace are phenominal and it shows in the behavior of the students. If you have complaints about the schools your child is attending, find a productive means to a solution. Complaning without pursuing a solution becomes a trait we would not accept in our children. The transistion can be what you make of it - for your child's sake.
Everything is not so wonderful at Roosevelt. Lunch time is still a problem for many children with only one person working as a cook and cashier. At recess there is not enough people watching all the young children. I have had to personally see what happens at recess. 175 kids running all over the lot, grass, between the building. 2 adults talking together off in a distance. One girl hurt- no one notices. It would be very easy for a child to be abducted and no one would notice. Talked to the principal once and she said adults were watching the kids.
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Strongsupporter
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Oct 26 2006, 09:28 AM
Post #90
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6th Grade
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- Shelly
- Oct 24 2006, 12:51 PM
Here's some good news from the front...I have a child at Roosevelt - her bus is on time, she loves to ride with her friends in the morning and afternoon, her classmates are all doing very well ( due to a fantastic teacher - Kim Carty), the staff at Roosevelt is wonderful beyond description and we are thrilled!! I have another daughter at Emerson who has developed into a beautiful, independant young lady. Mr. Toby and Dr. Wallace are phenominal and it shows in the behavior of the students. If you have complaints about the schools your child is attending, find a productive means to a solution. Complaning without pursuing a solution becomes a trait we would not accept in our children. The transistion can be what you make of it - for your child's sake.
Careful, you are not allowed to be positive on this forum! Glad to hear the good news. My son is at Cooper and loves it. Bus picks him up and drops him off on time. No problem at lunch. Great teacher. Loves the music program and his saxaphone. Has made many new friends and has connected with baseball and hockey teammates he wouldn't have seen under the previous K - 6 setup. LI is here to stay!
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