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Gift—Holmes PTSA; - LPS Board Meeting Minutes July 5, 2005
Topic Started: Jan 6 2006, 10:42 PM (1,568 Views)
Tyler_Parent
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Principal
There are equity issues with the district model (e.g. teachers union), based on an article linked by Elisa elsewhere. Senior teachers get preference on job postings, typically gravitating to the more affluent schools. Salaries are ~$70K/year at the top of the scale, and ~35K at the bottom. That article emphasizes how much more competitive schools could be were they to be funded locally, and not at a district level. Maybe I'm off topic a bit.

Parents don’t typically dig into their pockets when the kids come home with these fund raisers with the understanding that they are donating to the district. This appears to be a dirty little secret. By gifting the BOE, easing their burden in operating costs, do we not subsidize their position of being unwilling to outsource non-teacher union jobs?
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Want2move
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Man...this is something I haven't heard of before. :o
Given the state of things, I'm not sure I would trust this board to take control of this money.
The plot thickens.
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Grant1
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We have just begun to fight!
Our school rarely ( if at all ) "gifts" to the LPS - we use it for goods, supplies, books, equipment ( like the PA systems in the classrooms and the playscape ) within our own school, this way we do not loose control of the funds we raise.

Our only problem has been the school adminstration - in the past they had a practice of spending it before the PTA voted and allocated the funding.
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loyaltolivonia
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Grant1
Jan 7 2006, 12:43 PM
Our school rarely ( if at all ) "gifts" to the LPS - we use it for goods, supplies, books, equipment ( like the PA systems in the classrooms and the playscape ) within our own school, this way we do not loose control of the funds we raise.

Our only problem has been the school adminstration - in the past they had a practice of spending it before the PTA voted and allocated the funding.

Well, I never knew ANY of this.

My next question is...........WHO decides whether to "gift" $$$ to LPS or keep it and spend it on our own school? Is there an amount that schools automatically HAVE to 'gift' out?

Very interesting stuff, here. I have learned SO much in this last month I've been on this site. It is truly amazing. Thanks to all of you who know this stuff and research it :D
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Elisa
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Once the BOE gets the money either through pta or the foundation I can't say where it really goes. I don't ever remember reading in 'dialog' or elsewhere a reporting of how and where the money was spent. These are great accountability questions for the BOE and admin. Years ago I spoke with our former principal about pta funds raised and the possibility of those funds being used for programs for our students. From her explanation I understood the pta funds could be used for landscape around the school, a new school sign, donations of scholastic books to classrooms, craft night, and so on. I gathered she meant only things that did not directly effect the academics/curriculum. For example, a pta couldn't decide to fund a language program in my school. Conversely, money gifted to the BOE, ideally would be used equitably across the district (I am not saying that I know that happens though) and not just on one particular school and that it would be used for instructional purposes (hopefully never operating costs, that was my mistake of wording previously). So essentially, I understood that a pta could decide to use their money raised on their own school but only for certain items.
Remember when they were planning for school mergers how much building equity played into their choices. Equity is one of their guiding principles. The equity issues with pta raised money comes into play as far as particular schools having more successful fundraisers, more money and in turn differentiating it from others schools in the district. Additionally, and this is my own belief, the admin/BOE would never give parents, even pta, the ability to affect instructional practices in the buildings in any way. The admin/BOE, for me anyway, have made their thoughts on parental input and capabilities abundantly clear over the past few months.
Maybe some pta board members could weigh in on this?
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WestlandAin'tSoBad
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5th Grade
Nankin Mills PTA gifted around $11K in the Sring of 2004 to Nankin Mills Elemntary school. I'm sure we're listed in the BOE minutes. The PTA members that showed up voted for it. Basically we had money sitting around doing nothing and some programs might have been cut.

The principal already had in mind what he wanted:
Weekly Readers
color printer cartridges
beginner Dictionaries for 1st&2nd grade
DVD players
Digital camera
computer programs for the lab - the kids were

LPS purchased all the stuff and we reimbursed them. For a reason that escapes me, we couldn't just by the stuff for our school. I could have been a tax thing abd/or there are some procedures that have to be followed for purchases for LPS.
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Iliveon-Levandownbytheriver
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I have a question that is sort of related. Being new here...my daughter has a field trip where there is no bussing available. To me...i dont like that idea. So either I go or she rides with another parent I dont know? Or do if I dont go...does she not go..do you have to take your own kids? Not really explained to me..and she just got the permission slip.

If the PTA has money....which I heard Taylor does...why cant we use that money for busses for a field trip? Can someone help me? And if we are giving all of the money away to the BOE...is that why we cant afford bussing?
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Iliveon-Levandownbytheriver
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Sorry to be a pest again...seems like alot of schools are gifting monies to the BOE. Is this something that happens or is it new? And are they doing this to offset some of the costs for the LI?
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gr1
Principal
When a PTA/PTSA raises money for school items, books, PA systems, playground equipment or whatever, there is a proper procedure to follow in order for the district (school) to take ownership of it. It must be formally accepted as a gift by the BOE.

For example, if your PTA buys a PA system for the school. They present the monetary gift to the BOE and it is earmarked for a specific purpose. The BOE accepts the gift. Then the proper way to purchase it is through a PO created by the school. The PTA gives the money to the district and the district pays the bill. This way the PA system has been officially accepted by the BOE and they are now responsible for it's maintenance and any problems which occur. IF by some freak accident the PA shorts out and burns the building down, (on a weekend when no one is there of course) The PTA is no longer liable, the principal cannot get in trouble, because it was approved.

Many PTA's simply purchase and donate things without going through the red tape. This is fine for benign and inexpensive items, but any gift valued at over $1000 must be accepted by BOE. I'm not saying it's always done, but it is the proper procedure that building administrators are supposed to have the PTA's follow.

Some PTA's will lump all their purchases/events for an entire year together and present them to the BOE in one huge sum.
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ktmom
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Elisa
Jan 7 2006, 02:47 PM
Once the BOE gets the money either through pta or the foundation I can't say where it really goes. I don't ever remember reading in 'dialog' or elsewhere a reporting of how and where the money was spent. These are great accountability questions for the BOE and admin. Years ago I spoke with our former principal about pta funds raised and the possibility of those funds being used for programs for our students. From her explanation I understood the pta funds could be used for landscape around the school, a new school sign, donations of scholastic books to classrooms, craft night, and so on. I gathered she meant only things that did not directly effect the academics/curriculum. For example, a pta couldn't decide to fund a language program in my school. Conversely, money gifted to the BOE, ideally would be used equitably acroos the district (I am not saying that I know that happens though) and not just on one particular school and that it would be used for instructional purposes (hopefully never operating costs, that was my mistake of wording previously).
Remember when they were planning for school mergers how much building equity played into their choices. Equity is one of their guiding principles. The equity issues with pta raised money comes into play as far as particular schools having more successful fundraisers, more money and in turn differentiating it from others schools in the district. Additionally, and this is my own belief, the admin/BOE would never give parents, even pta, the ability to affect instructional practices in the buildings in any way. The admin/BOE, for me anyway, have made their thoughts on parental input and capabilities abundantly clear over the past few months.
Maybe some pta members could weigh in on this?

Gifting money to the BOE is not a new practice and you don't really write a check to the BOE. Its kind of complicated.
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Tyler_Parent
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I'm not sure how I feel about the idea of our PTA's raising money without a specific purpose in mind before hand. If I understand this correctly, the money is raised, and then it is decided how to spend it. To use the example in a post by Iliveon-Levandownbytheriver, its not like my child has brought home a fund raiser flier for the purpose of funding their field trip's bus transportation. I have no idea why they want to raise money, other than to have it and then spend it on "something." I've never given this a second thought before.
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ktmom
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Tyler_Parent
Jan 7 2006, 03:54 PM
I'm not sure how I feel about the idea of our PTA's raising money without a specific purpose in mind before hand. If I understand this correctly, the money is raised, and then it is decided how to spend it. To use the example in a post by Iliveon-Levandownbytheriver, its not like my child has brought home a fund raiser flier for the purpose of funding their field trip's bus transportation. I have no idea why they want to raise money, other than to have it and then spend it on "something." I've never given this a second thought before.

At the beginning of every school year the PTA sets a budget and that budget is approved by its members. Any fundraisers are done to raise the funds to support the budget. The budget typically consists of buses for field trips, school assemblies, money to the LMC, money for teacher supplies, etc. Any extra is then typically used to purchase extra nice to have items for the school, like playground equipment, special books, etc.
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gr1
Principal
Quote:
 
I'm not sure how I feel about the idea of our PTA's raising money without a specific purpose in mind before hand


Call one of the PTA board members at your school. I'm sure they can tell you what the purpose of the fundraiser is. They may have discussed it at a PTA meeting. You can check the minutes of those meetings to see what all members present decided to do with the money raised.
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Tyler_Parent
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Thank you (ktmom & gr1). I'm relieved to know that.
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klezy99
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Just go to Livonia school web site...click on BOE and then click on minutes... View the minutes.. you can read they are always getting Gifts......
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